CLASSICS (Bonus Episode): The Legendary Mike Greene!

Speaker 1 (00:02):
Big Food and Beyond with.

Speaker 2 (00:07):
Cliff and Bobo.

Speaker 1 (00:08):
These guys are you favorites, so like to say subscribe
and rade it.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
Five Stock and Greatest gone yesterday and listening, oh watching
lim always keep its watching.

Speaker 3 (00:26):
And now you're hosts Cliff Barrickman and James Bubo fay.

Speaker 2 (00:31):
Well, Bubbo. We have a great episode today. We have
someone on the episode who is a longtime friend of
both of ours. We've been on our expeditions with this gentleman.
This gentleman has filmed a Sasquatch, he's been on a
Finding Bigfoot episode, and he's one of our stops. Whenever
we're back east and hanging out, if we can call
this guy and have lunch or breakfast with him, we

(00:51):
do it every single time. Love this man, you know him,
and for everybody in the audience who does not know him,
Welcome to Bigfoot and Beyond. Mike Green, Hi, Mike, how
you doing today? Man?

Speaker 1 (01:03):
Gentlemen, it's great to talk to you again. I'll tell
you this is really great. It's a wonderful idea.

Speaker 2 (01:09):
I'm so glad you can come on. We've been meaning
to have you on for a long time, but gosh,
the way Bobo and I are kind of scatterbrained in general.
It's just taking us this long to get you, so
thank you very much for setting aside a little bit
of time for.

Speaker 1 (01:20):
Us anytime, anytime. I've been storing up horrible stories for
ten years.

Speaker 3 (01:29):
Yeah, that's been about ten years since we did that.
Mike was our main witness on the first episode back
in this twenty eleven, ten years ago.

Speaker 4 (01:38):
And yeah, he was.

Speaker 3 (01:40):
Just to give me a little background on Mike, I
think he was the chief investigator for the New Jersey
Fraud Department of the District Attorney's office or the Attorney
General's office. Yeah, and there's an army officer. So he's
not like me or something or cliffs and jazz musician.
He's a productive member of society, like one of the suits.

Speaker 2 (01:58):
I guess you call him the suits. You're in a suit, Mike.

Speaker 1 (02:03):
You know it's it's funny. If you looked at my resume,
i'd have to admit, yeah, I was a suit. But
once I got home and took off my tie, I've
sort of a jack I'm really kind of a jackal
and hide personality. Uh and uh, yeah. It was suity,

(02:26):
but it was interesting stuff. But my my free time
was spent doing Uh I didn't go in for bowling
and the PTA.

Speaker 3 (02:37):
No, I know, I was just busting busting balls on
a little bit. But yeah, I mean you were like,
I mean, you know, respected professional and all that.

Speaker 4 (02:45):
Smart guy. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (02:47):
Actually, one interesting thing that I did that that is
sort of germane to what we we all of us do,
is I was studied to become a what's called a
question documents examiner, which is basically you're a forgery expert
to testify in court as an expert witness. So you're

(03:09):
you're taught to well, in this case, examine documents to
see if they've been altered or they're true, or you know,
somebody's writing somebody else's name, that kind of stuff. It
teachers you to look really closely at what you're seeing
in front of you and pick it apart in your
mind and with your hands and sometimes with machines to see,

(03:32):
you know, if it's real or not.

Speaker 2 (03:34):
Which is directly applicable to like fake photographs and all
this other stuff. I mean you'd probably use that all the.

Speaker 1 (03:40):
Time, right, yeah, exactly, fake photographs, you know, casts and
certainly all these these videos that are on YouTube, But
you don't have to be a forgery expert to look
at most of those that much.

Speaker 2 (03:58):
Just that must just turn your stomach to turn on
YouTube and see all the garbage is out there.

Speaker 4 (04:02):
Oh it does.

Speaker 1 (04:03):
Yeah, I'm sort of amazed that people keep doing it,
there's so much of it.

Speaker 3 (04:09):
Well they're rewarded, I mean the fake stuff and like
the stupid stuff on there's it gets one hundred times
the clicks of something that's like serious and like you
know scarly about the subject.

Speaker 2 (04:19):
You've also had training with dealing with people, I mean,
because your all your investigations over the years, not bigfoot investigations,
like other stuff like I have it in my head,
like welfare investigations and some criminal stuff. You dealt with
the whole swath of society, So you must have a
whole just a laundry list of things to look out
for if somebody's lying to you.

Speaker 1 (04:39):
I was a narcotics probation officer, I was an investigator
for the Public Defender's Office. Uh and and and then
this chief of welfare frauds. So yeah, I'm used to
dealing with dishonest people.

Speaker 2 (04:56):
Boy, did you choose the right field to goof around
in on free time. Man, Bigfoot is full of those people.

Speaker 1 (05:01):
Yeah, oh it certainly is. It certainly is.

Speaker 2 (05:03):
Yeah, tell us how you really feel, Mike.

Speaker 1 (05:06):
Yeah, I would, but we're on the radio.

Speaker 2 (05:11):
I don't think a lot of people know you, just
because like you're not out in front and center. You know,
you don't have a group, but you do such good
work behind the scenes. Can you tell our audience a
little bit about the background of what got you into
the bigfoot subject. We know a little bit about your
professional background, but for bigfoot purposes, what brought you to us?

Speaker 1 (05:30):
What brought you to us was years and years ago.
I've always been a camper and a hunter, and camping's fun,
but it's a lot more fun if you've sort of
got something to do while you're camping other than sit
at the fire and you know, poke around and your
sleeping bag and get high. So I've always been interested

(05:52):
in stuff like Bigfoot and UFOs and kind of weird stuff.
So I read it up on it I thought, you know,
there's got to be so something to this. There's just
too much i'll call it evidence lying around for this
to be nonsense. So I started going on. I'd get
two weeks vacation of years. So I started going out

(06:15):
to the west coast Vancouver Island, California, up on the
Sierras by myself squatching. And after a few years of this,
I found out that up and you guys know about
this Whitehall, New York, right up at the bottom of
Lake Champlain, there was a whole lot of big foot activity.

(06:38):
And that was five hours drive from my house as
opposed to flying across country, so I could go up
and do this on the weekends. So I started going
up there, and there was a nature conservancy that owned
a big chunk of land that was right on the
bottom of lake, very bottom of Lake Champlain, which is

(06:59):
like a little skinny, muddy river. And I would sneak
in there with my canoe, hide the canoe in the bushes,
and then go in there and camp with a thermal.
And I did that for seven years, and once in
a while I would, you know, I'd see like scrapes

(07:20):
or a busted tree, give me a little hope, but
nothing really great. However, one night, just as I was
putting the canoe in the woods and it was it
had gotten dark, some two guys in a motorboat pulled
up and they couldn't see me because it was dark.

(07:44):
Stopped and they were talking to each They turned the
motor off and they're talking to each other, and one
guy said to the other, this is where he said
he saw it. And the other guy said, yeah, boy,
and then they drove off. That was it. But obviously
something had happened. And this was a great spot for
squatches to live. I mean it was very isolated and

(08:08):
hard to get to. Blah blah blah blah blah blah. Anyway,
so that perked me up. And then just towards the
end of all this, one night you've all heard whoops.
One night I would I would get up at three
o'clock in the morning, get out of my tent and
look around with the thermal, and then go back to

(08:31):
sleep and waiting for something to happen. Anyway, I was
just at three o'clock. I was just putting my boots
on to get outside, and all of a sudden, I
heard whoop wooo woo so loud. It sounded like somebody
was screaming in my ear. I mean, it was just deafening.

(08:54):
I've never I still haven't ever heard anything that loud,
but I said, thank god, you know, finally the squad
just put a stamp on this thing and giving it
some reality.

Speaker 2 (09:08):
Yeah, you're not wasting your time.

Speaker 1 (09:10):
Yeah, and you know, seven years is a long time.
I don't know how many times I've been up there
and then and you guys have all seen the squeaky
thermal that I took down here in the u Are
National Forest. Pure luck. I'd never been down here in
my life. My wife's son moved down to Charlotte and

(09:34):
we came down to visit him, and the BFRO was
having one of their stupid expeditions in the Ure National Forest,
and so I said, okay, drove down, dropped my wife
off in Charlotte, and drove out to the UII to
the campground. And I got there the day before everybody

(09:56):
else did, so there was nobody there and set up.
I got there like at nine o'clock at night. I've
been driving literally all day from New Jersey and I'm
really tired. Put up my little dome tent. Now this
is important. The campground has these tables that are built over.

(10:16):
They're like two by twelve's and cement, if you know
what they're like. They're very quite sturdy like dining tables,
if you will, with bench seats built on the either side.
I had one of these two burner Coleman stoves. Put
the stove on the table, opened it up, and for

(10:37):
some reason or other, I had a big stainless steel
pot like it makes spaghetti, and I put the pot
on the grill and then I put I had a big,
big like serving steel serving spoon, put that spoon in
the pot, and then I said, you know, I don't
know what I'm going to do, but I'm really beat.

(10:58):
I'm just going to go to sleep. So I left that,
got in my tent. I had my little raytheon two
fifty thermal, and went to sleep. Three o'clock in the morning,
which you all know is the witching hour. Three o'clock
in the morning I heard, and to this day, I

(11:19):
don't know what this was. I heard a PLoP noise
and it sounded like somebody dropping a water balloon on
the floor or a great big ripe tomato. There was
this PLoP noise down in the woods, and I just said, geeze,
what the heck is that. I didn't, you know, sit

(11:41):
bolt upright, but I just sort of laying there wondering
what that was. And this was in April, so the
leaves hadn't come out yet, but there was a lot
of drive leaves on the ground, and as I'm thinking,
what's that PLoP, I heard a little scraping of leaves,
just like I'm mouse running a little bit. And how

(12:03):
he got up this close to me, I have no idea,
but that's all I heard. The next thing I know
is and I was in one of those little dome
tents right literally over the top of the tent, there
were two big what I call Darth Vader roars right

(12:30):
over my head, followed by sort of a backhanded swipe
whack at the tent, which I've heard other people talk
about this basically the same thing happening, sort of a
whack at the tent, not to hurt it, but sort of, hey,
anybody home kind of thing. And this all happened much
quicker than it takes to tell about it. So I

(12:51):
whacked the side of the tent back just so yeah,
there's somebody here, occupied, occupied, and I heard it start
to run away boom boom, And then I heard a
tinkling noise, a metallic tinkling noise that sounded. All I
could think of was it's a dog's chain link dog collar.

(13:13):
It certainly didn't sound like a dog, but they made
this metallic noise. Anyway, I got out, went out, looked
around with my thermal nothing in the morning look and
it was the place is not conducive to fingerprints, a footprints. Anyway,
I looked over it and I still had this which
was this metallic noise, and about it was maybe twenty

(13:38):
feet away. It's the table with the Coleman stove and
the paw and the spoon. And I went over and
I gave the table a shot with my hip and
it made the tinkling noise. He had in running away
from my tent. He had run into the table and
jarred it and made that tinkling noise. The son of

(14:01):
a bitch, all right, anyway, So anyway, so I knew
it wasn't a dog.

Speaker 2 (14:08):
And that'll happen the night before the actual expedition even started, right.

Speaker 1 (14:12):
That's right. I'm all by myself. Next day, everybody shows up,
I'm telling them all about this. And then three o'clock
in the morning, once again, there's about five or six
of us sitting at that picnic table sort of talking
in low voices, waiting for something to happen, and you know,

(14:35):
you're just to serve talking low at each other. And
every ten minutes or so, i'd get up and i'd
take my thermal and I just stand around. And you know,
with a thermal, you don't have to look very hard.
The white things really jump out at you. And so
I just sort of standing around real quick, and I
sit down talking on top of the thermal. I had

(14:58):
a little baby digital video digital video recorder a DBR
that had and this is the stupidest thing I ever
did in my life. It had a two hundred and
fifty six megabyte not gig megabyte SD card in it,
about as small as you could possibly get, and I

(15:21):
was saving quote, saving that for when i'd really needed. Well. Anyway,
the last time I stood up, I looked around there.
It was about I don't know, ninety feet away walking
sideways to me, right to left, and sort of just

(15:43):
like in the movies, you get this big white silhouette,
hunky you know, no neck, big arms, hunky shoulders, striding
along to dump do dump dump dump, and I'm watching
it through the thermal, and I stupidly said, in sort
of a stage whisper, there's one now, And of course

(16:03):
everybody stopped talking, and I realized I didn't have the
video the DVR running.

Speaker 2 (16:11):
The yeah, because this particular thermal imager doesn't record internally.
This is the old days, pretty much a thermal imagery exactly.

Speaker 1 (16:19):
So I put it down, and it took me about
five or ten seconds to get the DVR up and running,
and I put it back up, and of course he
was gone. But I knew what I saw, and I
knew what happened the night before. Son of a bitch.
This is the place for me, I mean, and it

(16:40):
still is. It still is. To make a long story short,
my wife said, you know, really, what are we doing
up here? I'd like to be closer to my son.
I said, well, let's move. Let's move to North Carolina.
So yeah, two months later, I'm living in North Carolina,
thirty miles away from the best footing spot I've ever

(17:01):
seen in you know, now like ten years of this,
And so I started going there regularly, week after week
after week, and after a few years, I got that
squeaky thermal that everybody has seen.

Speaker 2 (17:17):
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and
Bogo will be right back after these messages.

Speaker 3 (17:29):
Yeah, so back to the squeaky footage, Mike, that was
taken to the same spot where you saw them inditionally
on the expedition.

Speaker 1 (17:35):
Correct, Yes, well, in exactly the same spot, and that
campground it's not particularly pretty and during the week there's
nobody there, so I'd always get I'm now, I'm unemployed,
I got all the time I want retired, so I
could go. I'd go down during the week and i'd
have the place to myself, and i'd go to that

(17:56):
same campsite and the stump where I had put the
zagnut bar that I would use for bait. And actually
I usually used the jar of peanut butter, but I've
forgotten the peanut butter, and I've had a zagnut bar
for myself. But so I felt, well, I'll take one
for the team, and I put the zagnut bar on

(18:18):
the stump.

Speaker 3 (18:19):
Had the peanut butter, had the peanut butter disappeared during
that time?

Speaker 1 (18:22):
Actually, you know, you know, the regular size can of
jar of peanut butter, they usually have like a red
top that's like three or four inches across, red plastic top.
And it's a glass jar or glass or plastic I
don't remember. But anyway, you need you need a thumb
and fingers to open that thing, and and and and

(18:47):
a raccoon's hands aren't big enough to do it. It's
you got a per You need something with hands as
big as a person to open a regular sized jar
of peanut butter. So I took a jar peanut butter,
opened it up, took up, scoop out, smeared it on
the lid, and then put it on the stump. In

(19:07):
the next morning, the red lid was lying there by itself,
the jar was gone, and there was no peanut butter
in sight. Anyway, what I'd usually do is set up
the jar. It's time. I was using the raytheon with
a better DVR on top of it. Set that up,

(19:29):
pointed at the stump, turn it on about eleven o'clock
at night, and go to sleep. And I did that
over and over and over and over. And then this
last time, as I was setting it up, I heard
down in the woods. I heard a rustling like something

(19:51):
walking around, and I thought, I'll bet you he's since
nothing had happened all these other times, I'll bet you
he's watching me right now. So I put the thermal
on the tripod, pointed at the stump, and as you
guys probably know, the Raytheon's unlike the newer, newer thermals,

(20:16):
don't have auto focus. You had to manually focus it.
And I was in a rush I did. That's why
you see the jelly donut instead of more of a
squatchy thing. Anyway, I put turned it, turned it on
the thermal. Then I got in my car and drove off,

(20:37):
drove away from the campsite so that there was nobody
else there. So obviously I had left the bait by
itself and it didn't have anything to fear, so to speak.
And I waited about two or three hours until I
knew that the battery on the on the thermal had
run down. And then I went back and the can

(21:00):
the bar was gone. The battery had run down, and
I had to wait until the next day till I
got home to recharge the battery and see what I'd gotten.
I'm sorry, the battery on the Raytheon and the DVR rundown,
so I had to go home and plug in the DVR,
and that's when I saw what I'd gotten and I

(21:22):
couldn't believe. I really couldn't believe it just fine, after
all this time to finally get something like that, I
was just beside myself. It was. It was really neat
and well, you guys know you've seen these things. It
gets to you. It gets you. You want it's addiction,

(21:44):
You want more and more and more.

Speaker 2 (21:47):
Yeah, I think that's the curse. You know that is
often associated with seeing sasquatches. You know, it's the curse
like either you're not going to let it go or
it gives you PTSD, like something happens to you. You
know that even being involved in the subject for too long,
you know, Yeah.

Speaker 1 (22:01):
I can't let it go. I mean I'm sort of
happily hooked because it's it's an extremely interesting, albeit expensive hobby. Uh,
it's fascinating. I just wish I could get more of it,
you know. The only way to do it is to
do it.

Speaker 2 (22:20):
Yeah, there's worse things to be addicted to.

Speaker 3 (22:22):
Yeah, for sure, I love seeing it. Like you said before,
I mean the whole behavioral aspects. It's not like the
clearest video thermal, but it's awesome and how much like
behavior it shows like the thought process is going to
scratch how cautious they are and how they sway in
the trees and crawl up.

Speaker 1 (22:38):
I know, I know it sort of when you you're
absolutely right, Bobo, when you when you know what happened
and you don't have to have somebody sort of walk
through the video with the with them sneaking up and
getting the candy bar. It really is the way that
how cautious it was. Uh, even though he saw me

(23:02):
drive away, he still acted like, you know, he had
to sneak up there.

Speaker 2 (23:06):
And I think you driving away actually probably played a
big role in it feeling safe enough to come up,
because it was one of the major flaws I think
with bigfooters in general, we all want to be every
one of us, I think wants to be Roger Patterson,
the guy holding her, the gal holding the camera. I
saw it, I filmed it. But you took yourself out
of the equation. You removed your own ego from the situation,

(23:30):
and the sasquatch responded in a way, you know, like
it finally finally felt safe enough to come up, and
even then, knowing you weren't there, it snuck up on
all fours.

Speaker 1 (23:41):
Yeah, it did it did? It's it's uh well, I
mean that's why they were what they are and they're
so successful because they're so careful most of the time.

Speaker 2 (23:51):
Yeah, and I think I'm paranoid, but I've got nothing
like candle to candle these guys.

Speaker 1 (23:56):
You know, speaking, and I wanted to. I want to
throw something in here, which is kind of neat and
I may be preaching you the choir, But do you
guys know about the flur and Seek little baby thermals
that plug into your cell phone?

Speaker 2 (24:13):
Yeah, sure you do, Yes.

Speaker 1 (24:16):
Okay, I took one of those. I took the SEK
one draws its power from the phone. The flur one,
you have to charge it up. So the seque what
I did is I bought an extension cord, if you will,
so that I plugged it one end into the by
phone and the other into the thermal, which is about

(24:39):
the size of a domino. And it's on a little
actually it's a little old tent pole that goes through
a little hole in the roof of my van and
it becomes a periscope and it's this little teeny, little
black thing sitting up there. And all I got to
do is twirl that little tent pole around and I
get a three hundred and sixty degree thermal view of

(25:04):
everything around me and the the as you know that
the app for that that's on your phone you can
record with and you can do all the color palette
stuff and all that. But for two hundred and fifty bucks,
I think that is really a terrific gadget.

Speaker 2 (25:20):
Now, how is the resolution, because that's one of the
major factors.

Speaker 1 (25:22):
Bad at all? Not bad, It's not no, no, no,
it's not bad at all.

Speaker 3 (25:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (25:28):
No, I'd say more than adequate. A lot depends, you know,
sometimes when it's been hot all day and then it's
hot at night and the trees still stay hot and
blah blah blah, things get a little bit kind of mushy,
But not much this I'd say this stands up very

(25:50):
well to others despite only costing two hundred and fifty bucks,
and the beauty of it having to have this little
tiny periscope and you can put it and do it
in the tent just as well when you have it
on your phone. The problem is you can you can
hold the phone in your hand and look, but you've

(26:10):
got the face of the phone all lit up with
the picture that the thermal is taking illuminating your face,
so you're you're not being particularly you know, unobtrusive. But
this separates the camera from the phone very neatly. I
it cost me like two point fifty or something and

(26:31):
on Amazon to get this extension court and it works great.

Speaker 2 (26:35):
Yeah, that'd be the way to do it, because you
don't want to light up your whole face looking at
a phone because I mean, I don't know, I think
sasquatches are very light sensitive. I'm assuming you guys do too,
And the last thing you want to do just blast
yourself with a spotlight while you're you know, trying to
get it not to run away, right.

Speaker 1 (26:52):
I have used this a couple of times in a
tent because sometimes I go tent camping down there and
I don't use the van, and it works just as
well in the tent. It's wonderful. You can stick it
in your pocket. You know, weighs nothing. There are really
a terrific gadget.

Speaker 2 (27:12):
Where were these things ten years ago, right when we're
hauling around two fifty d's in the.

Speaker 1 (27:15):
Woods, I know, I know, well, I found I found
now that the the some of the thermal imagers that
I've got. They what did they call it? I want
to say view vu E. It's made by Flur and
now the vu E. It's just a little standalone thermal.

(27:39):
You put some power into it and there's a video out.
It's about the size of my fist, maybe a little smaller.
Now they're very expensive, but the original version, which is
the one that I got on eBay, I think, costs
me about six hundred bucks. And it's great. It's weird.

Speaker 2 (27:59):
It's kind of like the path finders they used to have.

Speaker 1 (28:01):
Well, actually I still have a pathfinder too. I have
the pathfinder, the raytheon and the view and I stick
all three of them up on top of the van
at night and let them run into the DVR with
no luck.

Speaker 2 (28:18):
I have to say, but are you still baiting them
with a peanut butter or zag nuts or whatever.

Speaker 1 (28:25):
Peanut butter is sort of my favorite. I do have
recordings of babies crying, babies cooing, and children like little
kids playing in the playground, and fawn bleeds, and I
have fairly long recordings of all of those. And I

(28:46):
have a little PA system in the van that goes
through the hatch and the roof, I can really make
it sort of obnoxiously loud, which I think sort of
defeats the because if you're going to have a baby crying,
you know that the whole stadium can hear it. It

(29:06):
doesn't sound too real, So I try and keep it
down and hope that well, it's going to be whatever
it is is going to be close enough to hear
a reasonable volume of whatever it is that I'm playing.
But between the sounds and the peanut butter, uh, yeah,
that's about it, honey. Sometimes but I think Bobo, weren't

(29:31):
you guys big on like donuts?

Speaker 4 (29:34):
I was big on donuts. I don't know if the
big Foot was.

Speaker 2 (29:37):
And Bobo got big on donuts.

Speaker 4 (29:41):
I put out all kinds of stuff. The ones.

Speaker 3 (29:44):
I think I made such an antagonistic relationship with the
ones that were near me that they just never took
my food.

Speaker 1 (29:57):
If any of you had peanut butter experiences, pointing in
the bedroom.

Speaker 2 (30:01):
Yeah, this is a PG rated show. I've put a
lot of bait out over the years, or offerings or
whatever word you want to slap on this thing, and
I've never had anything taken to my knowledge, never once,
And I don't know if they just weren't around, because
obviously there are very few of these things, or it
saw me do it, or who knows, who knows. But

(30:22):
I've never been successful. But I do have friends beyond you,
of course, that say that they have been successful. And
I would bring up the Natella jar, the Natella cast
as being one of the most important examples.

Speaker 1 (30:35):
I mean, this is shap I'll be shallow. I want
to be the guy that proves it. Now, do you
carry a gun? Yes?

Speaker 2 (30:44):
To do that.

Speaker 1 (30:46):
Yes, you can edit this out if you want.

Speaker 2 (30:49):
No, no, no, no, all views are welcome.

Speaker 1 (30:52):
My that you know, my I've wrote that books scratch
for sale, yes.

Speaker 5 (30:59):
Which by the way, I'm proud to say still sells
fairly regularly on Amazon. And that book was written and
you guys are probably going to never speak to me again.
That book was written to be politically correct.

Speaker 4 (31:18):
It's all right.

Speaker 1 (31:19):
It does not mention that from day one I have
carried a gun.

Speaker 2 (31:25):
No, but you know what, I was surprised to learn
that you were carrying around tranquilizers back in the day.
Oh yeah, you know that.

Speaker 1 (31:32):
At first I thought I'm going to get close enough
when I went up to Bellakula. I had a tranquilizer gun,
and my vet convinced me. I convinced him. He gave
me a prescription for ramponds. The name of it it's
an animal tranquilizer. They still use it and in order
the darts and the gun through the over the internet,

(31:56):
and it's good for about fifty feet. But I thought, yeah,
what the heck? Well, you know, I soon realized that
if I even see one, I'll be lucky much less
get a shot at him. So I gave up. But
it was kind of fun to have a tranquilizer dart
gun for a while. But anyway, I traded it in
for the largest rifle with a thermal scope, which is

(32:20):
what I use now. And I will take thirty seconds
here and give you my rather shallow rationale, which is, men,
for better or for worse, and probably for worse, have killed,
stuffed and eaten everything, everything, including each other, on the planet,

(32:44):
absolutely everything. Why does this guy get a pass? All
we need is one.

Speaker 4 (32:53):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (32:53):
I've got mixed feelings, I really do, and I feel bad.
I don't feel bad enough. I guess I'm shallow or whatever.
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (33:07):
That's all good, you know, if you didn't feel bad
at all, you would frighten me.

Speaker 1 (33:11):
No, I have really mixed feelings about doing this, but
I you know, and you've all been in this as
long as I have. It is so frustrating, you know.
I look my wife, my son in the eye. They've
seen the video, they've heard me tell the stories, and

(33:32):
they're going yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But I know
what's going on. I'm sounding paranoid now. I know what's
going on behind those eyes, and they're going, you know,
is he crazy?

Speaker 3 (33:46):
Yeah? I don't know.

Speaker 1 (33:47):
I don't know. You and you guys, you know until
you see one and you know it for yourself what
you've seen, you can't swallow this one hundred percent.

Speaker 2 (33:59):
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and
Bogo will be right back. After these messages.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
I'm still a big believer in the not only do
they And I remember you, Bobo, talking about when you
turned on the infrared illuminator. One was coming across a pond,
I think, towards you, and you turned on the illuminator
and it turned around and took off.

Speaker 2 (34:29):
Yeah, yeah, that was me actually with the camera. I
was just trying to record the sounds because it was
something big was splashed around in the water and we
had sasquatches run us earlier that night. We're thinking, that's
got to be them. And I had the I had
one of those sony cameras with the one led in
front early night shots sort of take, and it was
like maybe a foot above the ground. I was sitting
by the campfire. There's no fire going on, but it's

(34:50):
all dark, and this thing wo or Bobo woke me up,
and I think it woke Bobo up. So I had
the camera but maybe a foot above the ground, and
I was just going to turn it just to record
the sound. Because this is way back in the early days.
I didn't have a lot of technology and all that
sort of stuff, you know, didn't have therms or even
recorders were very limited by battery and storage and stuff
at that point. So and I turned on the red

(35:13):
the video camera to record the sounds, but I didn't
know the night shot was on. And then that night shot,
that one led illuminator came on and immediately immediately at
the same time, all sound in the lake across the
pond there stopped and I never heard it again after that.
I say well, that's a very strong coincidence.

Speaker 1 (35:34):
I have absolutely no doubt that they can sense infrared.
I also will go a step further, and you know
the market lack of game cam photos considering the number
of game cams that are out there, which is, if
not millions, hundreds of thousands that they've managed to avoid.

(35:57):
I think they can sense electrical feeling. Undoubtedly.

Speaker 2 (36:02):
Yeah, they're sensing something. I always go with the hearing, like,
I think they can hear the electronics, but they might
be able to sense it else out.

Speaker 1 (36:08):
Well, I may may maybe hearing is the right word.
But you know how like pigeons can can nowhere north
is that kind of stuff. They got an extra sense
that that that that we don't have, that that tells
them that there's there's there's something over there that's generating

(36:32):
a little some sort of an electrical field, and for
whatever it is, I don't want to go close to it.

Speaker 2 (36:39):
Yeah, you know, for the first time I thought of that,
I was camping with Bobo up at Bluff Creek and
we we'd walked around that night we thought there was
one in the area because it sounds we're hearing, and
we went to bed and then I set my recorder up.
At the time, I was using mini disc recorders because
little hard drive recorders just didn't exist yet, you know,
or at least not in my prize range did. Maybe
they did, but I had a mini disc recorder and

(37:01):
they make a little bit of noise, and they could
only record for about seventy five minutes, seventy four minutes
I think it was, or you know, not very long
in a hour hour and a half. And we kind
of laid down and we're sleeping outside the tent and
just on the ground, and that saying was churning away recording,
and we kind of halfway dozed off, and then we
were awakened by something really close to camp, like in
these bushes that maybe thirty forty feet away, doing this

(37:24):
strange like growl, hiss sort of sort of thing. And
I go, oh, crap, and then I and then it
went away, and I checked the recorder it had stopped.
And I think, and I believe it happened right because
we checked the time. I think it happened within like
two or three minutes after the recorder stopped. Yeah, two minutes, yeah,

(37:46):
so yeah, it sounds about right. Yeah, right after the
recorder stopped, and that's the first time it dawned to me,
like there's something else up. Man, They're they're sensing something
about electronics. Maybe they're hearing it. Maybe it's something else
like you're saying.

Speaker 1 (37:58):
In this case, it was a sort of a change
of circumstance. Yeah. Yeah, huh.

Speaker 2 (38:05):
They're weird critters, man, I'll give them that. They are
a weird species.

Speaker 4 (38:08):
I think.

Speaker 3 (38:08):
The other thing to thinking about, Mike was when I
was that night when I had my first full you know,
crazy and kind of I knew that, like I was like,
oh my god, you know, the first time I knew
that for sure was a sasquatch, and that scared the
crap out of me.

Speaker 4 (38:21):
Had that night vision, and when.

Speaker 3 (38:24):
I was messing with the folks, there's the knobs in
the front and the battery covered nob was the same
as the focus and the the knobs, and as I
thought I was focusing it, I was unscrewing the battery
and as soon as the battery turned off as one
of the things screening. Within seconds, they all ran across
the metatories with like bluff, charged me and then ran

(38:45):
behind me.

Speaker 1 (38:46):
Wow. Yeah, same idea, same idea, and that's that In
a way, it is sort of the reverse. The electrical
current went off in both those cases and that generated activity.

Speaker 2 (39:01):
Yeah, you know, you know how they react like when
somebody leaves campers, drives away, sometimes you get knocks or something,
and it's very often about when something changes, they react
in some sort of way. Well, so, knowing as much
as you do us ask watches, having so much experience
in the woods, what kind of advice would you give

(39:22):
to our listeners, Like, what's in your opinion, what are
some of the best tactics to actually go out and
get something and bring something back.

Speaker 1 (39:30):
And when you say something, I assume you mean a photograph.

Speaker 2 (39:34):
Anything, No, I mean anything.

Speaker 1 (39:36):
Really, My suggestion would be, if you own an iPhone
or an Android, to spend two hundred and fifty bucks,
get one of those little baby thermals the size of
a domino, and get an extension cord of eight feet
long from Amazon and use that when you go camping.

(39:57):
And that way you don't have to expose yourself. I
haven't spent a lot of money, and you can easily
record and you can look around three hundred and sixty
degrees with this little tiny thing poking out of your
tent or whatever. It's an inexpensive way to get in
on the program and a very good way to record

(40:20):
it too.

Speaker 2 (40:21):
Now, how would you entice the sasquatches to come into camp?
Is it all zagnut candy? Is it all like food
and sounds?

Speaker 4 (40:27):
Or is anything else to do?

Speaker 1 (40:29):
I don't know what else to do, if you know,
if I other than food and sounds, I really don't
know what else there is. And I'd love to have
some suggestions.

Speaker 2 (40:40):
I got one actually, because I'm just thinking of the
other senses right now. Have you ever tried some sort
of olfactory attractants, like some sort of smells that they
would find interesting?

Speaker 1 (40:49):
Well that was the peanut butter.

Speaker 2 (40:51):
Oh, because you smear it on the outside right right.
You know a friend of mine, Chris Minier, we haven't
had the show yet, he'd be a great guest out
of the show. But Chris minni or the night he
saw his he soaked a bandana and what is that?

Speaker 4 (41:05):
Really?

Speaker 2 (41:06):
Really cheap? After shape? What the aqua velva?

Speaker 4 (41:09):
Is that?

Speaker 1 (41:09):
Right?

Speaker 2 (41:10):
Is that?

Speaker 1 (41:10):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (41:11):
He just went to Walgreens or someone bought the cheapest
one off the shelf and he just soaked bandanas in
that and hung those out a couple hundred yards from camp,
and that night he saw one.

Speaker 1 (41:22):
Really the idea a strange smell.

Speaker 2 (41:27):
Yeah, because you know, anything changes in their territory, they
got to figure out what's going on. Their life might
depend on it.

Speaker 1 (41:32):
Yeah, that's a very good idea that hadn't occurred to me.

Speaker 4 (41:36):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (41:37):
I think we're always going for the foods. I mean,
I think food may or may not work. I mean,
I've never had to work, but other people like you
have and Tom Shaye and other people. But I think
it's just a matter of interest. It's like those those
pheromone chips, you remember, playing with those things like that
doesn't smell sexy, like what in the world is going on?
But it sure might know? But it might it might
entice them. That might entice their their curiosity enough to think, like,

(41:59):
what the heck is that?

Speaker 1 (42:01):
Well, now we're talking about sort of tracking them on
a sexual level.

Speaker 2 (42:07):
Well yeah, yeah, Bubba could put his wig on.

Speaker 1 (42:10):
But I have and I've forgotten about this, but you
you know, this business about when they'll trade. I've put
out on that on that stump. I don't even remember
what it was a little rubber ducky or some three
pennies or something. I don't even remember what it was,

(42:31):
but a little something on the stump. And the next
morning that was gone, and there were three pebbles sitting
on the stump. So it was there was an exchange there,
which I've heard of. I've heard of other people talking
about that. As a matter of fact, I've noticed now

(42:52):
to my horror, around the U are, which is a
big there's a bit's a big area. You go into
different remote camp sites and where there will be a stump,
you will sometimes see a little toy or three. In
one place there was three pennies and it circled with

(43:14):
magic marker, and somebody had written on the stump, please
don't move these that sort of thing. So there's somebody
out there that's doing this little bait business. It's not me.

Speaker 2 (43:28):
So, Mike, I met you at in British Columbia. I
think the first time I ever met you were up
on the island there, Vancouver Island. But I mean we've
been to Olympic Peninsula together. I mean I think I
might have been in Florida together or something at one point,
North Carolina. All over the place really I mean.

Speaker 1 (43:44):
We've bumped heads at a lot of different places. You
and I spent the night together up on the hillside
and Dan, Vancouver Island.

Speaker 2 (43:52):
That's right, that's right. Yeah, Yeah, it was a great night.
I don't think they're taking any bigfoot stuff happened, but
it was great hanging out with you. Just made a
new friend. You know, where have you not gone that
you would still want to go?

Speaker 1 (44:05):
Nowhere? I know, I can't think of anywhere that i'd
want to go.

Speaker 2 (44:09):
Yeah, because you did it, You just up and did it.

Speaker 1 (44:12):
I well, I you know, I just like you guys.
You've sort of been everywhere now And the reason I
I had such good luck in the Yuwari and it's
only thirty miles away, it would be a waste. I mean,
I love the Northwest.

Speaker 2 (44:32):
One of the things that you got to do that
I know another guy who's done it as well. But
you took You're you're an accomplished you know, like sailor
basically you're you're you have your you have nautical a
nautical background. Didn't you take a boat up to British
Columbia and like sail the islands?

Speaker 1 (44:48):
And uh, well, actually I did it wasn't British Columbia.
It was Quebec. You can see if you if you
look on the map of Quebec up towards Labrador, you'll
see and you can see this on any map. You
can see it from outer space. It's a sixty mile

(45:08):
wide ring with a forty mile wide island in the
middle of it. It looks like a great, big wedding ring,
and there's a there's a river that runs from it
down about thirty miles to where they built an enormous

(45:29):
hydro electric dam. And this is about one hundred and
twenty miles from the Saint Lawrence. So you drive up
along the Saint Lawrence and you take a hard left
and you go up this dirt road for one hundred
and twenty miles and you come to this hydro electric
dam end of the road, and you can drive around
to the top of it, and there's like a place

(45:51):
where people put boats in. There's nobody around except the
people who run the dam. And we went up up
there three times before we were trying to circumnavigate the island,
and the first time we had an open sixteen foot
sailboat with a little motor and the second day in

(46:16):
it got all foggy and rainy and you couldn't see anything.
So well, all we could do was just set up
our tent and sitting in the tent for like three days.
It went on and on and on, and anyway, we
ran out of time, so we had to do We
wouldn't have had time to go around, so we turned
around and came back. Next year, we went back with
a motor boat, and I had calculated how much gas

(46:39):
I was going to need by driving up and down
the Delaware River, and I really screwed it up. I
brought what I was going to be more than enough
to get around this forty mile island and back down
to the dam. And it was rapidly apparent at the
end of the first day that my gas consumption estimates

(47:03):
were way off, so we had to turn around and
bring that back. Then next year we went up with
a seventeen foot little sailboat that had a little tiny
cabin on it so you could sleep in it, which
was a big help, and that we sailed. We did
sail it around. It took us twelve days. We went
around it. It was beautiful, beautiful, nobody nobody around it

(47:29):
just wonderful country, nice weather. It it's called the Mannicuigon Reservoir.
And if you look on a map of Quebec up
towards Labrador, you'll see a big city. You can't miss it.
It's a big, sixty mile wide circle and it stands

(47:50):
out like a like I don't know what the moon
or something, but it was a neat place anyway. I thought, boy,
that'd be a good place for a squatch.

Speaker 2 (48:00):
Yeah, it's an ecological reserve. I have it on the
map here and it's called the Louis Babel or Lewis
Babel Ecological Preserve. Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond
with Cliff and Bogo will be right back after these messages.

Speaker 3 (48:20):
I mean, there's so much great habitat in Canada to
just to like, you know, put up a map and
throw dolls and you can't go three out of four
gonna land in a good spot, you know for habitat.

Speaker 1 (48:31):
You're right, I don't think I knew about anything much
going on in Quebec. It always seemed to be the
northwest part of Canada. But why not.

Speaker 2 (48:42):
Yeah, yeah, they've got to be up in there. I've
got a couple of things from the main border area
in Quebec but not. But I think it's just because
so few people are there. So many people overlook the
ideas like, oh, Washington have so many big foots. Yeah,
but Washington has a ton of people. That's why there's
so many in reports from California as well. They always
overlook the people element in the reports. You know, where
there are no people, you aren't gonna have any sunsquatch reports.

Speaker 3 (49:05):
Well, one last thing. You had a pretty funny story, Mike,
your Bluff Creek expedition.

Speaker 1 (49:11):
No, I'll tell you briefly. I put an ad in
the paper. I wanted somebody to go to Bluff Creek
squatching with me. This guy answered the paper so yeah,
and he had a brand new for it explorer that
we could use. It's great. So I go, Penny, Oh, yeah,
I've been camping blah blah blah. I go pick him up.
It turns out he's a meth head bouncer at a

(49:36):
bar in wherever the hell we were, San Francisco, I guess.
And anyway, he was a complete jerk, absolute jerk. Got
out there and we went up to Bluff Creek and
camped up. There was a there's a dirt road that
leads up past the lake, and we went up in

(49:57):
there and camped, and I gave him the I gave
him the video camera, and I had the rifle, and
he immediately started seeing things. Oh there's one, there's one
video here, video there, blah blah blah blah blah. We

(50:17):
had the car parked pointing slightly downhill, and it was
a very shallow downhill, and he decided I was going
to sleep in the tent. He was leary about sleeping outside,
so he slept in the car. I wake up in
the morning. The car is now fifty yards down the road,

(50:40):
run off the road, with its nose in the bushes.
He says, Oh, I woke up in the middle of
the night and I turned on the headlights and I
saw one and I thought I would I would creep
up on it or something. I don't even remember now. Anyway,
so he said I didn't want to turn the end on,

(51:01):
so I coasted down there, and then I ran off
the road and fell asleep. Well, and this is a
big RV. We couldn't get it back on the road,
and even if we could, the battery was dead because
he'd gone to sleep and left the headlights on. I
hiked down the fish Lake, which a couple of miles

(51:22):
and I ran into a couple there. They're driving along
and I flagged them down. They took me to the
ranger station. I talked to the ranger and I showed
him my you know, investigator I d blah blah blah,
and he very nicely drove me back up there and
he said, Bobo, you know this as well as I do,
he said, He said, be careful up here for me,

(51:44):
he said, he said, all these guys growing pot up
and he said, and I'm the only law round. And anyway,
we got up there and he jumpstarted the car for me. Fine, okay,
so the car, we got the car running, the ranger
goes away. Then the next day we drove down to

(52:10):
Bluff creeb We were up and we drove down to
the creek itself and parked the car and we started
walking down along the side of the creek and he
said stop stop. He said, there's there's people over there
or something like that. And I said yeah, yeah, yeah,
yeah yeah. He said no, no, no, no, there are there

(52:31):
are there are. So I said, okay, we'll turn around
and we'll walk up the creek. So we walk up
the creek and we go for about half an hour,
and he said, there's somebody behind that tree there. He motioned,
he said, the guy motioned to me to go back,
and I said, yeah, right, I said, okay, Look, I said,

(52:53):
we're going to go up ahead to hear up the creek,
and we're going to hide, and we're going to wait,
and if he comes up here, we'll confront him. So
of course we went up there and hid, and nobody
showed up. He hadn't seen anything at all. He was
the guy had now freaked himself out. That that night,
he said, I gotta go have a drink. I got

(53:15):
to go to town and have a drink. And I said, well,
I'm not going. I said, just okay. Well, he took
the car and he didn't come back until ten o'clock
the next morning. I mean, at this point he and
he had done from the very beginning, everything he did

(53:36):
was stupid and wrong and really annoying and and delusional.
So I said, that's it. We're going, packed up in
the car, drove back. He dropped me off at the airport,
and that was it. And I never saw him again.
I'm really sorry you were reminded me of that. That
was one of the most unpleasant four or five days,

(53:58):
whatever it was. I've spent my.

Speaker 2 (54:00):
Life, which is I guess why you go big footing alone?

Speaker 3 (54:02):
Now?

Speaker 1 (54:03):
Yeah? I do. I do. I really like it by myself.

Speaker 2 (54:06):
I do well. Mike. Thanks so much for coming on
Bigfoot and Beyond today. It has been far too long
since all three of us got to hang out and
just shoot the poop for a little while. Man, miss you,
I miss you.

Speaker 1 (54:17):
Man.

Speaker 2 (54:17):
You're a kind of a fixture in my big footing
life for a long time. And now we live on
opposite coast and we just don't cross paths very often.
So thanks very much for coming on and hanging out
for a while.

Speaker 1 (54:26):
You are very welcome. It's been great talking to you all,
and I wish you all the best. And I've got
a son living in Santa Cruz now, So the next
time I'm out that way, I'll co look you guys up.

Speaker 2 (54:40):
Yeah, I give us a holer. Maybe I'll drive. We
can all rally and Bluff Creek and have a good
trip out there without all the weirdness.

Speaker 1 (54:46):
Yeah, I'll leave the guns at home. Too your choice.
All right, guys, well, thanks very much for having me on.
It's been great talking to you, and I hope we
can do this again and soon. Take care.

Speaker 3 (55:02):
Why uh, well, I knew you'd have an entertaining show.
It's Cliff.

Speaker 2 (55:06):
I love Mike, man. It's been far too long since
we got to hang out with that guy.

Speaker 3 (55:10):
He's got a he's got a ton of stories. He's yeah,
he's put in the time and he's been rewarded first time.
I mean he's frustrated he hasn't got more of it,
but he got that great thermal footage. I mean, I
mean Stacy's is great because it's so big and you know,
it's dwarfs me. It's you can see it head to
toe in one frame.

Speaker 2 (55:28):
Yeah, the Stacy Brown video, the thermal video of the
sasquatch from Florida.

Speaker 4 (55:32):
Right, Yeah.

Speaker 3 (55:32):
And then Mike's is you know, it's a it's it's
it's great because it shows more behavior. But when we
did the recreation was it wasn't really much bigger than me, not,
you know, not terribly bigger.

Speaker 2 (55:43):
Well, they're not all eight, eight or nine footers. Man,
there's a whole lot of six and a half and
seven's out there, I think.

Speaker 3 (55:48):
Right, you know, less I forgot was that was the
one I got poison. I got poison. Ivy doing that
recreation crawling up for the stump. All right, Cliff, well shoots,
that was a good one, and we got more good
ones coming up. So uh, I'm excited. These have been
really good episodes.

Speaker 2 (56:03):
Yeah, I've got a couple of wonderful guests trying to
schedule them at this point. And you know, there's so
many jobs happening on speaking engagements and stuff right now,
so I know that you and I are very very busy,
So we'll work our butts off, get some of these
things scheduled and kind of share our conversations with our listeners,
who we really appreciate. By the way, thank you very much.

Speaker 3 (56:21):
Yeah, thanks a lot, you guys. And keep on sharing
and liking those buttons.

Speaker 2 (56:25):
Yeah, I love those buttons. You're like frog and toad.
Well this is not my button.

Speaker 3 (56:30):
Thanks so much for listening. We appreciate the support. We
appreciate you guys sharing it and liking it, you know,
hitting the buttons that give us the clicks so we
can do more of these. So until next time, keep
it Squatchy.

Speaker 2 (56:47):
Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Bigfoot and Beyond.
If you liked what you heard, please rate and review
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(57:07):
and tweet us your thoughts and questions with the hashtag
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